Hazing

Dees · 30-10-2003, 21:16

Ok. I need HELP! A letter was sent yesterday to the ASU pres. saying that me and a group of my close friends HAZED some freshmen girls! I have to wright a letter stating my involvment. I'm NOT a hazer, but it only takes one of thoes girls to say that they were hazed by me and I'm going to JAIL!!! I can't go to jail, I'm only 19! What should I wright?

Mossopp · 30-10-2003, 21:31

Erm, ok - define "hazed" cos I'm not familiar with that term.

Anyway, no matter what "hazed" means in this context, you cannot be sent down just because someone claims that you committed a crime. They have to proove it. And if you're innocent then they can't proove it.
I wouldn't worry just yet. Write the letter stating your side of the story and then see what happens.
Good luck.

Dees · 30-10-2003, 21:47

Hazing: Aka paddling. And other physical stuff.
The point is, I haven't done any of it, but all it takes is one of the girls to say I have and I'm out of school and in jail.
Thanks, you gave me a good start.

Disengage · 30-10-2003, 23:16

Quote:

Originally posted by Mossopp

Anyway, no matter what "hazed" means in this context, you cannot be sent down just because someone claims that you committed a crime. They have to proove it. And if you're innocent then they can't proove it.

It's not that easy. If this is in the US it all depends on how good the lawyers are. This country's judicial system is practically run by lawyers. I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade here, but that's just the sad truth. However, the system does go by innocent until proven guilty, so being the defendent you have that advantage.

QueenBee · 30-10-2003, 23:20

Someone please explain to me WHY I wanna live in the USA..

Anyway, Dees, I really don't know what to say to you. It's not often I meet someone who is in this situation (actually I have never met anyone in a situation like this) but... I hope all goes well for you. *Tries to think of something else to say*

PowerPuff Grrl · 31-10-2003, 01:13

What little knowledge I have of the legal system in the States (hell, even that of Canada) I can say that the victim(s) usually has the favour of the judge/jury during sexual harassment trials. Unless the victim(s) and the defendent(s) had past relation, the favour goes right out the window (or so I have read) for some strange reason.

I wouldn't suggest for you to wait for something to clear your name, most likely nothing will come up. If this is really serious you're going to have to be proactive about it. My best bet would be to get some sort of alibi; something that can prove that you were somewhere else at the time of the incident.

Anyhoo, I hope those Freshmans get through with it ok. God knows that is some fcuked-up situation be in. And I truly hope the punks that did this get their comeuppance in prison.

Dees · 31-10-2003, 04:51

Yea, this is a Fugged up situation. And today it's only getting worse! I guess I will just wait it out.

cirrus · 31-10-2003, 06:50

Hope it goes well. One good thing is that they need proof. Otherwise, it's their word against yours, and if you get sent to Jail because someone "said so", I'm sure you'll win a case to sue them! There isn't proof... right? Anyways - I don't know you, but just the fact that you'd post on here about something no one would no about anyways, lets me know that it really bothers you and you're worried. No matter what happens, we'll care

Disengage · 31-10-2003, 15:23

Haha cirrus, if he gets sentenced to jail then he would have already gone through with a trial. I don't think you can sue the judicial system for giving you a sentence you don't like.

cirrus · 01-11-2003, 22:16

Disengage, Haha, you're right. Guess I was being optimistic and not realistic. But they can't put you in jail if there's no evidence during your trial. That's what I shoulda said.

QueenBee · 01-11-2003, 22:20

Well you never know what can happen in the United States.. :P Nah, I'm just kidding.

I hope it all goes well Dees. I don't think they will put you in jail just because a girl says you did something. They need proof as most of us have already stated..

guesshoo · 01-11-2003, 23:47

okay maybe its just me but..........i am still a little unclear on the meaning "hazing".
do you care to elaborate?

madeldoe · 01-11-2003, 23:49

Quote:

you cannot be sent down just because someone claims that you committed a crime.

actually, as absurd as it may seem, that is not necessarily correct. I know because I witnessed it first hand. A friend of mine was caught in the wrong place at the wrong time and was accused by a 13yr old for stealing her shirt. She called the cops and they came and took my friend to jail. Trial date is still pending. [thats the story in a nutshell]

Anyway, what are the terms? As in, are the girls pressing charges [are the authorities involved?] or is this strictly a school thing, where your liable to be expelled? If the situation worsens, I strongly suggest getting a lawyer. Good lucks though, I hope it works out for the best.

Main Entry: haze
Function: transitive verb
Inflected Form(s): hazed; haz·ing
Etymology: origin unknown
Date: 1840
1 a : to harass by exacting unnecessary or disagreeable work b : to harass by banter, ridicule, or criticism
2 : to haze by way of initiation <haze the fraternity pledges>
3 West : to drive (as cattle or horses) from horseback
- haz·er noun

guesshoo · 02-11-2003, 00:24

wow dees, sounds like a serious problem you have on your hands.
since i'm no lawyer, just a debator i wish you the best of luck my friend.

thanx for the definition nataku.
long time no see.

haku · 02-11-2003, 03:12

Like many people have already said, the first step is to get a lawyer. Don't write any letter stating your involvement before consulting a lawyer, even to say that you are not involved. And don't talk about what you did or did not do with anyone.

This could be very serious because you don't seem to know what was exactly done to the victims. Hazing is a very vague word. It could mean that those girls were forced to do something humiliating like scraping the floor with a toothbrush, but it could also mean that they were forced to strip, or even molested.

You have to know *exactly* what you're accused of in order to defend yourself properly.

Bitty2002 · 02-11-2003, 05:34

Dees, For one, most likely, this will not reach the actual police. It will stay as a campus police claim. I know this because I know all my campus statitics. Out of 111 harrasment reports, 1 was reported to the actual police and then dropped. Often the compus authorities will handle it "secretly." If you ARE guilty and valid proof is shown, you may have to pay money or leave the school. But most likely they will brush it under the rug because they don't wantanyone to know hazing happens on their campus. If this "hazing" is a sexual offense charge then you shouldn't worry. The victim pretty much never wins. You see the system is really messed up and if you kick down someone's door because they stole your plasma TV, THEN you get in toruble, you sexually assualt someone and well, it is the victim's fault. They are all lying tramp whores who like to ruin upstanding men's reputations and swindle money out of them. Unless this person has proof or eye witnesses, which if you truly didn't do anything they can't have ...unless their is someone who will lie for them...you should be okay.

If this isn't sexual, it is more iffy. I believe you that you didn't do anything, but if you were with people who did, you WILL be held accountable if it is proven you were with them. This may seem completely unfair, but that is how the legal system tends to work.

I would truly need to hear more about what this person is saying you did versus what you truly did. Hazing isn't enough. If you can show this person has motive to frame you, that is good. Not to mention the pressure is on her to supply the proof. Often hazing or sexual crimes are subject, his word against hers.

PS I cannot tell you what to write, because I do not know what you involvement was. Were you there when it happened but did not participate. Were you helpless? Did you not help the girls? Did you do something you shouldn't have, but don't see it as hazing? Is there any way that you may think you did something innocent, but a girl may feel over powered and you not realize it. I am assuming you are a guy...if I am wrong, soo sorry. If you are a girl, that changes a lot of the dynamics. You should write the truth. Exactly what you saw, what you experience, how you felt, and yor thoughts during the event. If there wasn't even 'an event" say that. Find someone who can back up where you were at the time.

Mossopp · 02-11-2003, 14:45

If there is a chance - albeit a very slight one - that this whole thing may end up going to court, is it really wise for us all to be talking about it so openly here?
I understand that Dees is only looking for advice and reassurance from us and I, like everyone else, am more than happy to give him that. However, I don't think it would be wise to get into great detail about what did/didn't happen here.

Bitty2002 · 03-11-2003, 02:41

Mossopp, why not? I am just curious? If one of us were on the jury, that would be the only way it matters, right? It isn't wrong to discuss what happened. In fact, as often the case, when a defendant or prosecutor feels that legally they do not have enough evidence, they will appeal to public opinion. They use the media and press to get out their stance. Just curious what you meant.

Dees · 03-11-2003, 03:05

And the investigation is still underway. They haven't asked me anything by myself yet but the have talked to others who were accused of hazing with me.

madeldoe · 03-11-2003, 04:39

Who's doing the investigating? The school or the authorities?