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Old 08-10-2003, 18:47   #41
denial denial is offline
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Denial's homework submittion 1

Hi Sunny

Okay I admitted it was so hard for me to pronounce the Russian sound expecially the ы. You teach better than any CDROM or learning books. Maybe someday you can publish your own.. eh!

Here my homework. Okay I'm slow.. but I'm trying lol..

My own notes: (trying to understand how to read)
http://www.geocities.com/fadzila_h/text1.html

My vocal practice:
http://www.geocities.com/fadzila_h/10vocals.mp3

My vocal practice for difficult consonants:
http://www.geocities.com/fadzila_h/diffconsonant.mp3

Quote:
I used the pair of vocals 'э' - 'е', first leaves the consonant firm, second makes it soft, remember?
My consonants (own note -*proudly* )
http://www.geocities.com/fadzila_h/consonants.html

My vocal practice consonants
http://www.geocities.com/fadzila_h/consonants.mp3

Well I still need to practice my tongue to get use with those sound, I spent 2 hours today. *feeling proud* ..well that was because I came home late tonight at almost 11pm. But it was really fun! Thanks Sunny .. ya tebya lublub.


Extra:
Well a HAPPY student can't help but to sing!
http://www.geocities.com/fadzila_h/sing.mp3


To Russia with love
-Denial


*Broken links edited.
*For mp3 ..use right-click -> save to local hard disk.
~~~~~~~~~~~
I will forget my dreams
Nothing is what it seems
I will effect you
I will protect you
From all the crazy schemes

You traded in your wings
For everything freedom brings

You never left me
You never let me
See what this feeling means

Last edited by denial; 09-10-2003 at 06:31.
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Old 08-10-2003, 23:26   #42
zebu zebu is offline
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Quote:
Great job, zebu, especially if it is your first attemt speaking Russian!! If you don't mind, I'll coment a little... When you say "мы" it should sound a lot harder than english "me". There is no equivalent sound in english but if you listen to cool's file - she has it right Everything else sounds very good, especially those 'ж' sounds which are supposedly difficult. So you did a fantastic job overall!!!
of course I don't mind you commenting especially when you give such nice compliments

Quote:
zebu i loved your recording. thanks for posting it. if this is your first attempt - wow. I think for Slavic people...it just comes naturally
it's nice to find that being Slavic comes helpful sometimes
I had fun hearing your first recording, I especially liked that noise you made at the begning
~~~~~~~~~~~
pogledaj da li me mozes presnimiti
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Old 09-10-2003, 00:10   #43
elf elf is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by coolasfcuk
sunnich thaaaaaaaaaank you for all the explanation - very helpful and appreciated. I on the other hand recorded a little blaaaaaaaaaabing of myselff, or more like a lot of it...sine I love talking and now I am hooked on recording myself instead of typing:
Blaaaaaaaaaaaah blah blah
I also recorded some 'extra credit':
Extra Credit
[/b]
Nice job, cool, It seems like you really like talking and I trully enjoy listening to you I especially loved the way you pronounce "elf"

Ok, let me comment a little with my contructive critisism... First, the extra credit - Ирония судьбы, Или с лёгким паром (It is still considered by many as the best Russian movie ever made!). You read it really well overall but here are some minor mistakes that I noticed. Underlined are the sounds you pronounced a little incorrectly and stress is marked bold:

*нетипичная
*в Новогоднюю
*Эльдара
етверо
*что - should be pronounced more like "што"
*точно - other way around ^^^

Also a general comment, when you pronounce же or жи- it should always sound as жэ and жы respectively, i.e. a lot harder Which leads me to the discussion of the soft-hard issue. The first time you pronounced the Bulgarian phrase, it sounded "Russian" and the second time it sounded "Ukrainian" (which is softer than Russian). So I'm thinking maybe you shouldn't try so hard to make your Russian softer... just my oppinion

Anyway, you are doing really good, keep up the good work!
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Old 09-10-2003, 01:27   #44
coolasfcuk coolasfcuk is offline
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Quote:
Nice job, cool, It seems like you really like talking and I trully enjoy listening to you I especially loved the way you pronounce "elf"
Thanks you elf, very much - and I know... I have accents in any other language than Bulgarian, but what can you do... accents are sexy after all - so it could only be an advantage...unless I am dealing with some complete 'redneck'

Thanks for all the comments again, will put them in practice, and esp. this one
Quote:
The first time you pronounced the Bulgarian phrase, it sounded "Russian" and the second time it sounded "Ukrainian" (which is softer than Russian). So I'm thinking maybe you shouldn't try so hard to make your Russian softer... just my oppinion
he heeeeeee, you are not the first person that says that.. that I shouldnt try to speak so soft when I try to speak Russian - my friend Pavel said that too - so I should listen more I must be completely 'deaf' then....

off.top: just to add quicky about the movie... I love it too...only watched the first episode yesterday though, about the watch the rest tonight. it is called 'The Irony of Fate, or Enjoy your Bath' in English, and it is an American DvD, and also has subtitles in English/French/Spanish... so people that would like to see it should look for it at the rental place

denial, wooooo hooooooo thanks for posting.
loved listening to it - you are doing very good - I thought you pronaunced those sounds better than you did in the Singing thread. Too bad I couldnt see the sketches.... says there is an error..boooooooooo. And the singing at the end - priceless
~~~~~~~~~~~
oh... o!
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Old 09-10-2003, 05:42   #45
coolasfcuk coolasfcuk is offline
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sasha, thanks for the file - just listened to it

I love the start, and that 'Privet'! That was perfect. I'll have to say - that was really, really good - maybe being Swedish is helpful for Russian too any language that rolls the 'r's is good - poor native English speakers - that is hard for them


btw - off top: I have a think for sweden and swedish and always wanted to learn some I love how swedish sounds - it just 'flows'
~~~~~~~~~~~
oh... o!
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Old 09-10-2003, 06:23   #46
vesica vesica is offline
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Hello to all those in the classroom.
First of all, Thank you Sunny Poison!
I have registered another yahoo geocities account named: spasibosp
the password is: yssunnd
Anyone can use this account, and I will upload my file when I have the time.
I have deleted my earlier message, but most of it, apart from the upload bit is still accurate.
(deleted message: Thank you, Sunny Poison!
I will definitely read this thread from time to time. I also think it would be fun to take lessons. I have recorded a file Via the message board search engine, I have found out where to upload it and have done so. I hope this is alright. I also have a YSSU file.
The sad truth is that all this may be utterly dreadful (to me it is neutral) and so you may ignore it entirely. I will not mind.)
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Old 09-10-2003, 06:48   #47
denial denial is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by coolasfcuk
denial, wooooo hooooooo thanks for posting.
loved listening to it - you are doing very good - I thought you pronaunced those sounds better than you did in the Singing thread.
..*eats her ego* ..

Quote:
Too bad I couldnt see the sketches.... says there is an error..boooooooooo. And the singing at the end - priceless
boooooooo I edited it to html so you can see it now.
Enjoy. There I was writing cyrillic.


oh Thanks Cools for the restless support. LOL LOL



Sasha, been trying to download your sample .. its cutting half way. Do you have ICQ? Do you want software so you can record in MP3 so the file will be smaller? Just let me know.


Vesica ..Privet! and welcome ... so you're a new student. Are you single?
~~~~~~~~~~~
I will forget my dreams
Nothing is what it seems
I will effect you
I will protect you
From all the crazy schemes

You traded in your wings
For everything freedom brings

You never left me
You never let me
See what this feeling means
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Old 09-10-2003, 07:23   #48
KooReeT KooReeT is offline
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Hey SP, I hope you don't mind a late enrollment, your lessons have been very helpful, especilally in my job where their have been a number a Russian customers and the phrases "Good day" and "Goodnight" have been very useful as well as everything esle you have gone over.
Thanks
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Old 09-10-2003, 12:07   #49
vesica vesica is offline
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I misplaced the old files, so recorded new ones. I have put them up here (hope they work):

exercise
question
If they are disastrous, I shall leave the school and learn Hindi instead.
denial.... a rose for a rose, I suppose

EDIT: have added a smaller file: speaking-quickly file

Last edited by vesica; 09-10-2003 at 15:26.
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Old 09-10-2003, 12:49   #50
denial denial is offline
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Lesson 1 - homework II

About Russian stress! Finally I understand it!!
Thank you SP ...
http://www.geocities.com/fadzila_h/stress.html

*looks back at her note*
I think I'm missing something ... what if you replace that 'o' (at the end) with 'e' ... what will it sound like? spasiba also?

...see I'm studying .. lol

PS: tell you a secret . I always thought that stress bar on top you have to "stress" the sound ..


vesica, wooo ... love your recording ... wish I could help but I'm a new student as well .. here more for you .. you sound so sweet .. where you from?


KooReeT, welcome ..welcome .. take your sit ...
~~~~~~~~~~~
I will forget my dreams
Nothing is what it seems
I will effect you
I will protect you
From all the crazy schemes

You traded in your wings
For everything freedom brings

You never left me
You never let me
See what this feeling means

Last edited by denial; 09-10-2003 at 13:11.
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Old 09-10-2003, 14:36   #51
la aurora la aurora is offline
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Sry, guys for the delay. I know, I was supposed to post these comments last night but ur teacher is a student herself. So when I came back home yeasterday, it was over 11 pm already and writing these answers I just fell alsleep right there on my keyboard at about 3 am. Haven't sleept for 2 days already, so got up only at 4 pm. I have a kind of day out, so I'll answer ALL of U in some hours (i hope so...) I'm also planning to post Lesson 3. Here's what I was able to write last night.

queenie, say the text of the first excercise. We are learning to read now, u know... if U still have some difficulties after my explanation, listen to the files that were already post. I'm gonna upload my own variant but just a bit later. I want other students to try first.

Elf, ukrainian? but first language is russian? how? Anyway, would like to hear U speaking and if U have no problem with it, U could become my assistent... the process is so intense, that I def wouldn't mind having one or two

Yeah, and somebody, explain prostrel how to record (or I'll be to do myself 2morrow)... U doesn't HAVE TO do recording, guy. It's all voluntary... U are my student anyway. I just don't like the idea that U don't do ur homework ONLY coz U don't how... It's not supposed to be so.

Oh, coolie, don't do this with me! I really DO enjoy ur voice a lot. And it's always useful to have some audio english paractice... but my connection is so slow and expencive, that after downloading all those files, my account is almost empty. So, don't be surprised if I suddenly dissapear for a weak or so. I'll need some time to save some money for connection I'm in a kind of financial crisis now. If this happens, I'll be working on the studying schedule for U all this time, I swear! Hope U have enough material to work with at the moment. And cool, as U have the higher level right from the beginning, I won't mind having some other extra-exercises from U. U and Elf could also find something to entertain the rest of the students if I'm absent for long, ok?

But I still need to ask u guys, to post ur files in MP3 if possible. I'll be downloading ur stuff anyway, but it would just be a bit faster *read: cheaper* for me... :P And cooooolie, plz don't be too lasy and type some of the things U say (U can record the file and just type the general meaning for me). Files over 2 Mbs make me wanna cry, really. I so want to get them and I just sit in front of my screen waiting for the downloading process and knowing this is may be the last time I'm online. huh...
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Old 09-10-2003, 14:41   #52
la aurora la aurora is offline
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Now to ur extra-exercise. Huh... U sound pretty... russian. Now kidding There are just few mistakes. So few that they aren't even worth mentioning. But *cough* I'm a teacher *me? teacher? heeell!* so I'm gonna do it The most noticeble one is in the word четверо. See what I mean? yeah, it's that damn stress again... (all other stresses were right btw ). But U felt urself something was wrong, didn't U? Yep, Elf is right, in the word новогоднюю, last н should be softer. U still need to make ur ц and ж a bit firmer and ч in the word точно should sound like clear ч, not something between ч and ш. Two names mentioned in this text should also sound a bit different. Everything else is oh so right! I recorded the right variant for U. Sry, I wrote down the russian text U read and when I read from the list in russian... it's just stronger then me... I remember my radio experience and read too fast may be (U know, U have to be in time there). I also forgot to pronaunce the name of the movie and missed one word in the main text but U pronaunced those things 100% right, so U don't need it anyway Oh... *turnes red* and don't pay much attention to my english. I didn't have any speaking-practice for quite a long.
http://www.geocities.com/nrg2002ru/coolextra.mp3
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Old 09-10-2003, 14:42   #53
la aurora la aurora is offline
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I don't wanna argue with U about wich of 2 languages is softer. Does it really matter? I heard the difference between the Sofia and not-Sofia pronunciation, and got ur argument that U don't use soft consonants that often. But the thing is that bulgarian firm к, с or ж for example sound softer than russian firm ones. May be that's why I get the impression that the whole bulgarian language is a bit softer May be I'm wrong still. Btw, I would like to get some Bulgarian lessons if U don't mind it can help me a lot if I'm next time in Bulgaria (and I really hope I will be )

zebu VERY good for the first attempt (wow, is it really the 1st one???) Only few mistakes. Yep, that мы should be a bit firmer may be but it's still ok. Watch ur т in the word простые, it shouldn't be that soft. But in the word эти making it much softer than U did would be right. С in вопросы is firm, don't forget. 2nd part is perfect, just чт in the word что should sound as 'sht'. U pronaunced it right in the 2nd case but not confident enough in the first one. That's all I could notice. Everything else was 'russian' *congratulates herself with one more smart student she got*

*joins zebu and Denial at the smoking-room to have a break*
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Old 09-10-2003, 15:18   #54
coolasfcuk coolasfcuk is offline
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Quote:
Oh, coolie, don't do this with me!
I am sorry sunnich! Was not thinking.... I completely understand what you mean - when I send stuff to my cousin it's the same - and when I am in Bulgaria trying to download stuff I go nuts! So from now on I promise I will type more, compress the files, so they will be about 1Mb. Dogovorilis

now... about that file ... that voice - what were you talking about before....still cant convince me it isnt sexy
and your English....wooooooooooooooooooooow... are you sure you havent lived in English speaking country for a while?? it is Perfect - it is as good as mine if not even better
you pronaunce my name great - I will record a tiny file how I pronaunce it - but you got it 99% right - you just gave it a lil Russian sound - I love it. that's exactly how russkayatatu pronaunced it while she was in Bulgaria - I hope she uploads something here so you can hear her Russian, 'cause to me she sounds more Russian than American - you know it Rach
Thanks for the great comments and correct pronaunciation again.

I will love to teach you some Bulgarian i x-change - hope it will be ok if I do it here, 'cause I dont think there is a big desire from other people to learn BG

ok, hope you dont have to be gone for too long because of my big files!!!

vesica thanks for the files. One more very good one - I think we are only 'smart' kids in this class.
and to try to answer your question... I am not sure ...but both things you played by t.A.T.u. are ne. so I dont think there should be any difference between them.

denial, thanks for fixing the jpgs. ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, I love them ! Nice handwritting - let me guess - you were an 'A' student - when it comes to notes I am
~~~~~~~~~~~
oh... o!

Last edited by coolasfcuk; 09-10-2003 at 15:26.
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Old 09-10-2003, 18:54   #55
la aurora la aurora is offline
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Analysed rest of the files. I need to say, guys, that I'm proud of U. No one of the students was just fooling around. I'm very pleased to see that U all have actually read Lessons 1 and 2 and put much effort in reading correctly. Guess, any professional teacher would envy me. Ur results are great (and even 'unbelievebly great' as it's ur first experience) and it's all ur own merit. Thank U... I really see now what I started this all for. And U give me the reason to continue. I really want to now. Thanks one more time

sasha, as I said already, U did a great job I don't expect U to sound 100% russian. It's impossible. Especially having in mind that it's ur first practice. But U sound like a person who is ABLE to speak russian but just has a slight accent. It's a great destination, believe me. Some ppl live here for years and still pronaunce words worse then U do.
U learned the lessons really well. I couldn't expect any more from U, I swear! U tried to pronaunce things exactly how they should sound. U didn't mix up the sounds. Just some of them weren't clear enough. But it's ok as U don't have such sounds in ur own language. So, U can leave it this way (U'll be understood) but if U want to improve a bit, here's what U need to pay ur attention to:

Both O's in продолжаем should sound even closer to 'a'. Same goes to the word простые.
The difference between soft and firm consonants should be bigger. Watch out ur 'н', 'л', 'т' and 'д'. If any of these letters is followed by 'ь', 'ю' and 'и' they should sound really soft. If 'ы' or 'о' goes behind, then make them firm. 'Ж'is always firm, even in the word продолженья. 'Х' followed by 'и' should sound a bit softer.
But great job, I repeat And 'привет' was perfect
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Old 09-10-2003, 18:55   #56
la aurora la aurora is offline
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vesica, welcome to our class! Not, ur file isn't 'utterly dreadful' at all. U are a smart student (like all of u, guys here!) U even surprised me in a good way. Where are U from? Just few mistakes here, really few... wow...
As well as sasha and some other students, U need to pronaunce 'a' a bit clearer when see unstressed 'o'. Don't make the consonant soft if 'ы' follows it (мы and сы in our case), make ur 'х' in плохи softer and 'ж' in all the words firmer. That's all

Ur question now. Well, there are 2 service words in russian that look and sound almost the same 'не' and 'ни'. Both are used for denial. And russians often don't know which one to write (although there are strict rules for this). But in our case, we have only 'не' in all these phrases, right?
не знакомиться
неверная (huh... i have my doubts if this should be written as one word or separately as it depends on the punctuation in this case and hell knows what author of these lines really meant. I wrote it as one word as it'll be easier to explain this way)
не первая
Let's start with the second one. It's easy. As "не" is just a part of the word, unstressed 'е' sounds as 'и'.
But what's the difference between the first and the 3rd one U ask (damn, why do I always type 'sak' instead? In russian it sounds exactly like... well U know urself lol)? I'm answering: although знакомиться and первая are two different grammar categories, there's NO difference. usually U'll be to read both as 'ни'. It's not a question of the stress in any particular word. 'Не' is just a service word and in the sentence it doesn't have the logical stress on it. So, when u say it fast, it sounds like 'е' is unstressed. But in the first case (in this song), Yulia puts this logical stress on it (to be in rythm or to mark that 'it's better NOT to meet'). See what I mean? The stress is there and that's why it can sound like 'е' or something between 'е' and 'и'. Hope U get what I mean, uff...
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Old 09-10-2003, 18:56   #57
la aurora la aurora is offline
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And now the owner of my soul, real Devil and just one of the sweetest girls around... ladies and gentelmen... our Miss Denial.
Wow! So u teach urself in ENGLISH? huhu... Glad to see that u write some cyrillic letters, as it def helps to learn them easier than just seeing them printed or typed. U put lots of effort in all this 'learning russian' thing and it should def give U a great result in the end. keep going this way, girl!

Although I haven't given U a task to repeat what I pronaunced in my files, it's good that U did. It can be a great help for ur studyings. I listened to ur files attentively and here are my comments:

vocals:
Whoohoo! Right! Everything. Even 'ы' *applause*

consonants:
бэ - бе (U made some difference but first should be firmer and second - softer still)*
вэ - ве (*)
гэ - ге (*)
дэ - де (Need to work on this. U tried to make difference using the vocal, not the consonant itself. That's why both consonants sound similar. Firmer - Softer)**
зэ - зе (**)
кэ - ке (**)
лэ - ле (well done! )
мэ - ме (well done! )
нэ - не (well done! )
пэ - пе (well done! )
рэ - ре (**)
сэ - се (well done! )
тэ - те (almost... Firmer-Softer again)
фэ - фе (well done! )
хэ - хе (**)
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Old 09-10-2003, 18:58   #58
la aurora la aurora is offline
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diffconsonant:
з - right
й - right
х - right
ц - sounds like 'с' in ur case... but it should be 'ц' (say "it's" and U'll get it)
ч - never thought I'll be to say it one day but: make it firmer Like english one... urs is too soft
ш - firmer again. Like in 'shop'
щ - wow! usually it's one of the most difficult consonants for foreigners but urs is perfect!

Quote:
I think I'm missing something ... what if you replace that 'o' (at the end) with 'e' ... what will it sound like? spasiba also?
The answer is right in ur notes. Look again.

Don't mix this "akan'ye" and "ikan'ye" things:
"akan'ye" means unstressed 'o' sound like 'a'
"ikan'ye" means unstressed 'e' (didn't want to confuse U but 'я' and 'ё' also) sound like 'и'.

So, if U replace 'o' with 'e' U are no way getting 'spaciba'. It will be 'spasibi' (and such word doesn't exist in russian).

Hm...
Quote:
... so you're a new student. Are you single?
What is this? Please, no flirting in the classroom! Not like I'm jelous...
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Old 09-10-2003, 19:06   #59
la aurora la aurora is offline
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vesica, thanks for willing to share ur space as this my account is almost 83% full.

KooReeT, U are welcome and as we say here 'it's never late to study' Everyone is welcomed whenever he wants to join.

Following Denial example, I uploaded one picture. It's a handwriting of the 1st exercise that I do for every of to to mark the mistakes there Just thought it could be interesting for U.
http://www.geocities.com/nrg2002ru/exercise1.jpg

Whoa... guess it's all at the moment. If I missed anyone, sorry, didn't mean to. Just let me know, k? Gonna bring new lesson some hours later.

love ya all!!! Chmoki.
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Old 09-10-2003, 19:13   #60
la aurora la aurora is offline
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P.S.
Oh, coolie. Don't be sorry. It's my problem, not urs *thinks about killing her greedy provider*

about that file *blushes* I'm still conviced it ISN'T...
And last time I was speaking English was more then 3 years ago... (at my english exam). That's why I don't feel confident speaking...

Huh... russkayatatu would be really welcomed. And thanks for promissed bulgarian lesson.

Muack! *goes away to finish lesson 3*
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