Gay High School

[QueenBee]

Lцfberg, you read my mind!

[Lцfberg]

Well, that was what I wanted to suggest in the first place.

[Tom Violence]

At the age of twelve I changed schools, because of the amount of physical and psychological abuse I suffered at my local secondary school. This was simply the product of a bitter-hearted herd mentality in my peers. It wasn't about my sexuality or anything specific - except maybe that I was open about wanting to learn, in an environment where that wasn't cool.

Changing schools was hard. I was brought up not to run away from problems, but it did mean an end to the abuse I had been suffering. It's impossible to speculate what lasting effect staying at that school might have had, but even having left when I did, it's taken long enough to rebuild my self-esteem. And, finally getting to the point, this is why I'm in favour of this idea.

Teenhood is a hard time, there are few people more limitlessly cruel than teenagers without sentimental education. The hurt they cause to their victims often lasts years. So I'd much rather see those gay teenagers who want to study in a comfortable, supportive environment able to do so. Hopefully this will enable them to develop into self-assured adults, without the type of emotional difficulties abuse so often creates. Allowing some poor teenagers to suffer isn't the way to re-educate society. We should let everyone have the best chance to flourish thoroughly. And If gay people can navigate their teenage years with as few obstacles as possible, their self-assured adulthood ought to be best way to show homosexuality in a positive light. Whatever that means - as if we expect straight people to be good examples of their 'kind'.

I'm not sure whether I'm getting my point across or not. My instinct is against segregation, but my experience guides me away from my instinct.

[Khartoun2004]

Darje that was well said. I totally agree with you. Just this past year I had to be removed from my Math class because the teacher and students were making homophobic comments and my phsychologial as well as my physical well being was threatened. I barely passed the class for the year as a result and now my GPA is messed up.

Gay high schools sometimes mean the difference between life and death for some GLBT students. Let's not forget that GLBT youth account for 30% of the 500,000 completed suicides in the US every year or if you will 1/3 of the gay population. I don't know about the rest of you but that troubles me greatly.

It's all noble to talk about changing peoples' opinions but what do gays do until that happens. Just grin and bare it? I hardly think that's a fair judgment to pass. I also think that the fact that the US government is willing to support a gay high schools shows how far the gay rights movement has come. Even though the country is currently being totally controlled by the right-wing. Which in the US has always been against GLBT rights.

The gay community should in my opinion be celebrating this as a victory. It shows that people are finally acknowledging that there is a serious problem of harassment and that they are trying to fix the problem. Even if the gay high school isn't the best solution, at least it's a step forward and a temporay solution.

[Charles]

If %95 of the graduates from this school do in fact go on to college as the principal states, and that is significantly higher than the city average (and I bet it is), then you will eventually get a heterosexual student wanting to go there for the acedemics alone. What then? If you tell a straight kid he can't go there because of his sexaul orientation, then isn't that a kind of segregation? Even if there is an equally good school he or she could go to, the US Supreme Court ruled against the idea of seperate-but-equal schools ages ago.

As I said before, short term, this is good. Long term, everyone else needs to get a clue.

[LenochkaO]

http://www.hmi.org/Youth/HarveyMilkSchool/default.aspx

The Harvey Milk School, a collaborative effort between The Hetrick-Martin Institute and the New York City Department of EducationЃfs Career Education Center Alternative High School Program, is the nation's first accredited public high school designed to meet the needs of gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender and questioning youth (LGBTQ).

I'm familiar with the expression LGBT, but what does "Questioning" mean in this context?

[PowerPuff Grrl]

Originally posted by darje
but white people didn't try making black people white ...

Ok, this is totally off topic but I just have to say that yes, actually they kind of do... but this is neither the place nor time.


I have to agree with Charles here, no matter how rough it is for gay students segregation is never the answer, it'll only perpetuate the problem.

The only solution to homophobia is to bring awareness to the issue. Have more GLBT associations into the schools. Punish the shit out of students who would dare harass a student on the basis of their sexual orientation. Actually implement the ideals of tolerance onto the school system because based on precedence, it is bound to work.

All this segregation thing is going to do is create a bubble of false security for GLBT students that will pop after they graduate. No matter what, these students will face reality and will have to deal with homophobia. I can only imagine that having that kind of sudden realization would be more traumatizing than what gay students face already.

[russkayatatu]

I'm pretty sure "questioning" is something like "bi-curious"...i.e., you don't know but you think you might be gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender etc.; you're "questioning" your sexual identity. And in this context I guess it means that this high school is open to and for the needs of everyone who thinks of himself or herself as "not straight."

[forre]

I voted no. Why to separate gay people? Are they sick or something? Sounds kinda weird.

[skye]

Originally posted by queenbee
darje, bizarre... Whats gonna come next? An all gay country?

Lena said that she wants to be the president of gay world If those really come true, Lena could make her dream come true But to be honest, not all gay people like them

[Kappa]

Lena said that she wants to be the president of gay world If those really come true, Lena could make her dream come true But to be honest, not all gay people like them

Nooooooo, but I certainly wouldn't mind Lena as my president, queen, tyran or mistress... Wipe the last one.

forre, it is not that we're sick, but as Charles said, it is a good short-term idea while society changes its ways with homosexual youth. I am sure that while some straight people also suffer from bullying, it is ten times worse when you go out from abuse in school into abuse at home, in the street, segregation in restaurants, public bathrooms... etc.

Then again, Charles, I turn your questioning to the other side: what about all those times in which a gay youngster was denied admitance to this certain school activity, segregated not only by schoolmates but by teachers, given low grades only because of his/her sexuality? I think it's quite fair to do to brilliant intolerants what they did to brilliant homosexuals.

[karxwp]

I voted no...instead of making people realize all the people are the same and that it doesn't matter race, or sexuality they are making that difference bigger...oookaaay you save the bulling and stuff like that...but don't you think the school will be a target for homophobics?

[Charles]

Originally posted by darje
Then again, Charles, I turn your questioning to the other side: what about all those times in which a gay youngster was denied admitance to this certain school activity, segregated not only by schoolmates but by teachers, given low grades only because of his/her sexuality? I think it's quite fair to do to brilliant intolerants what they did to brilliant homosexuals. [/b]

An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth? Then soon we shall all be eyeless and toothless (with my apologies to Ghandi). The examples you cite are morally wrong, yes, but punishing "brilliant intolerants" might serve to perpetuate hate, not solve it. This school in a sense is a positive reward to compensate for hateful treatement. Gay students are knocked down by society, and this school can help them back up.

[XSpex]

I don't think gay students need a special place like a whole high school for them.
It sounds weird, how can we learn to be tolerante if such segregation is made?

[Kappa]

I still insist.

I may be resented, but the reason why I am not studying in a good high school is because a homophobic teacher gave me F's in Math through the whole year, when I wasn't even bad at the subject, thus making me go into extraordinary exams to pass Math and missing the period of entrance of the high school I wanted to go in. How should I feel? Grateful that thanks to him, I have to get my high school certificate on my own, with no teachers to help me on the way?

This is pointless. The only thing I say is that I like the idea of this high school, because it provides a safe environement for queer students.

[Kappa]

Originally posted by XSpex
It sounds weird, how can we learn to be tolerante if such segregation is made?

At the cost of 900 gay adolescents killed per year, if not more? It is not fair that for heterosexual people to learn to be tolerant, they have to get scandalized about us getting killed.

Think X-men, people. People will not learn tolerance until they have us missing from their society, and even then it'll be a while. I have seen the most gruesome murders, made by boys barely my age. The reason? "Oh, he was a fag."

[parrish122]

Hmmmm....I'm torn on this one.

Because my mind agrees that people won't learn to accept us if we withdrawl from society. That is part of the reason I am so out. I have the rainbow sticker on my car, I even have gay pride symbols on my checks. So clearly, I think it is important to be as out as I can.

However, I can't forget the abuse I took at school when I was a teenager, and I wasn't even out then. My friend Samantha *was* out, and she went through more hell than I care to remember.

With both of us, the large majority of the teachers looked the other way when we were picked on or even attacked. I still, even 17 years later, can look down at my right hand as I'm typing this and see a scar I picked up during one of those attacks.

If we'd been given the chance to go to a gay high school (assuming that by some miracle our parents wouldn't have flipped out) I know both Samantha and I would have jumped at the chance.

A better solution would be, I think, to somehow make the schools care about the welfare of *all* their students. It seems to me that we *are* moving towards more acceptance. Much more so than when I was in high school.

But should we leave gay teens in harms way? It is all well and good to talk about eventual acceptance.....but that doesn't mean much to the kid who has just gotten beaten, or even killed.

<Sigh> I guess I'm rambling. I'll stop now.

Parrish

[Kappa]

I agree with parrish. I guess I am too sensitive about this but I'd rather see gay youth being protected than being used as a way to get heterosexual people to be tolerant about us. Just that.

[rylettia]

In this case, I highly doubt that constant contact will lead to acceptance any time soon. Teens are very insecure and impressionable. Homosexuality is the main target of insults, and at this age where fitting in and popularity is law, most kids will say "this is so gay" if everyone else will. If you don't, you jeopardize your social status, and the joke's on you. Well, that saves them, and the trend continues. If the hate crimes have doubled in the past ten years, isn't it obvious that gradual tolerance isn't quite working?

True, not everyone hates or abuses gays, but then again, they're not the problem here. Will a BULLY teen change after going to school everyday with homosexual people? It's like giving him or her cleaned and gutted fish in a barrel to hunt. The bully has to live with the gay school mates for at least four years, maybe s/he'll change! Well...a gay student might have to live with abuse for at least four years, maybe she or he should just start accepting it? ><

It may be a temporary, four-year fix for a kid, but that's four years away from abuse, four years to mature with people who understand and empathize, and yet another four years for homophobes to grow up. In the "adult" world after high school, even the tiniest bit more of maturity and acceptance than there was in high school is present. It may be leaving heaven for hell, but would you rather grow up leaving hell for hell?

Darje is right: we have been denied opportunities. The lower side of the graduating class of my school is still accepted to prestigious private colleges like Stanford or Johns Hopkins. It has a "legacy" so to speak. However, I'd probably leave it in a second to be in a more comfortable environment. Hell, I'd give both of Darje's kidneys and mine :P Though, if I do leave, it'll probably be because I was expelled. If the head master or my advisor found out I was gay (or just paid attention), there would be so many parents lined up to enroll me for public school/psychiatric therapy, it wouldn't even be funny. Luckily, I only fear for my physical safety sometimes...mostly, all they can take from me are opportunities. Is that worse?

Race segregation is quite different from this. Racism is a physical, superficial hatred. Homosexuality is regarded as morally or religiously violating. Isn't it defined as a "sickness"? I'm guessing hate based on belief is stronger than hate based on aestetics.

And...erm, it said they INTENDED to have 95% of the class continue to attend college. If I was trying to propose something for government funding, I would say that same thing. No sane principle would advertise his school as a breeding ground for cretins.

[LenochkaO]

I had a feeling that there were arguments like this in favour of the school - am quite glad I went for the "don't know" option rather than an outright no...

<changes mind more often than her underwear >