[freddie]

Originally Posted by Argos

And what...?

Think about it some more.

Originally Posted by Argos

Oh, you could recognize such things?

Well it's my (not so isolated) belief and pretty much common knowledge.

Originally Posted by Argos

Imagine, I saw a documentary where they proved that the KGB killed John F. Kennedy and I saw a documentation which made no doubt that the moon landing of Apollo 11 was total fake, completely produced in the studio. Oh yes, I believe everything what TV puts in front of my nose.

Yes, only stuff that comes from Russia, right?
The thing is... it wasn't some crazy conspiracy documentary made by people who made ridiculous films about Roswell & 9-11. It was done by our own on-the-field-reporters, who're still employed by our national tv. But whichever... this is a bit futile, I think. I can't enforce my sources on you as absolute truth and neither can you do the same to me. But this is my belief of what happened in Georgia till Shakashvilli took office.

Originally Posted by Argos

Boris Yeltsin had many friends, Mikhail Gorbachev for example. Didn't impede him to give Misha the boot.:

Indeed. Because he was useless to him after.

Originally Posted by Argos

Well, let's summarize - Shevardnadze loosens his country from Russia, rearms Georgia with an every year growing support from the USA, begins to build a pipeline with western money, which is totally against the interests of Russia and at night tells the Russian president all the secrets he heard from his western partners. --->
Ok, I have to go easy on my diaphragm, it already hurts..:

I'm glad you're seeing my side of things finally!

Originally Posted by Argos

Interesting that the USA, with all their CIA agents in Georgia (and Russia), supported Shevardnadze practically until the end, and the EU diplomats had hard work over months to convince them to abondon this guy and cooperate with the opposition. Oh yes, I forgot, Amis are stupid... ...And there goes reason down the river...

I'm sorry but that's just full-out wrong. The international community was very clear in criticizing apparent irregularities in the voting process during 03 elections, including the US. By that time it was apparent Sheverdnandze's accumulation of power had become too great to risk anything, and the Rose revolution would never, ever have gone through weren't it for the full blessing of the international community (US included). Not to mentiont the guy who succeeded Ed was an ACTUAL western symphatizer and more favourable to the US than Ed could ever be.

Originally Posted by Argos

My choice is - believe the numerous diplomats who have repeatedly expressed their irritation (like Condi Rice, Steinmaier, Kouchner...) or believe that they all are liars and only USAshvili tells the truth.

You're apparently selective reading. True Shakashvili had it's fair share of difficulties and not extremely smart moves as far as the seperatists are concerned, but US&EU politicians tend to acknowledge him as a breath of fresh air in that region's politics. Someone with no Soviet past whatsoever, someone who's been educated in the west and someone who actually understands the power of compromise and communication. I think

Originally Posted by Argos

Geostrategically it's an absurdity, for stability and integrity of Georgia it makes no sense too. Testing Medvedev is by far not reason enough (considering the negative consequences), but there may be one reason - the American presidental election. The Republicans seem to be distinctly behind, the frictions in Georgia are definitely a support for Mackie's campaign, that's a clear home match against Obama.

Georgia is no Iran. It's not nearly important enough to make much impact on US elections. And with an unpopular war on Iraq, public opinion not favouring an invasion on Iran and Americans having enough other things on their plate (the subprime crisis to start with), I think it's safe to say any sort of active role in this conflict is highly unlikely.

Originally Posted by aRGOS

Not that I have the firm opinion that Bush really has something to do with this, I'm more inclined that it's Saaki's own game, but we shouldn't exclude any possibility from consideration...

What game would that be though? I mean seriously... it's a country that's absolutely tiny going against the military remains of what was once a superpower? No one would be foolish enough to fight the windmills like that; especially considering the fact western powers would never allow themselves to get actively involved in the conflict.


ETA: A makeshift ceasefire is currently in place, but both sides already report violations.