View Full Version : The War on Iraq has started!! I bet t.A.T.u. is mad
Bhales07
20-03-2003, 04:07
What do yall think about t.A.T.u.'s stance on the war, and what is your opinion about the war.:done:
Bhales07
20-03-2003, 04:13
Surgical strikes have taken place to take out Iraqi Leaders is Souther Iraq. Sorry France, Germany, and Russia.
PowerPuff Grrl
20-03-2003, 04:14
I just think they are just reflecting the stance their country has taken.
Strangely enough, my stance is coincidentally reflective of my country.
Well, son of bitch! We have something in common!
:)
ETA: But I'm no patriot.
man idk i really just dont know, I live in the US. And like if we dont do this war, we leave a mad man wit weapons of mass destruction. If we do go through wit it (which we prob are) then we take out a mad man, but 1 of many through out the world. In my opinion, i really have no clue, there is just to many ifs in this war.
Where tatu stand, i think obviously they are against it, as their country is. Russia doesnt want nothing to do with this war, on the other hand tho, they are such a big target to iraq as the US is. So Russia really cant say that they are right, same goes for France and Germany.
Personally I am not for war, but sometimes you just have no choice as a country. As i said tho, i really cant say how i feel bout this war, really dont matter now tho, we are bout to go into this full force. God be with the innocent, and the ppl of the United States and their allies.
Disengage
20-03-2003, 04:20
While they are against the war, I doubt it is much of a priority to them personally.
I hate the War generally.
P.S. I'm moving this thread to the General Forum. Let's discuss war-things there. No offence. Just some order. :)
You guys didn't seriously believe that Bush is going to listen to Tatu, did you? :rolleyes:
PowerPuff Grrl
20-03-2003, 04:25
That would be amusing but I don't think we are trying to determine that.
Unless...
i think voicing out our opinions before the decisions are made is absolutely fine. however, i think as americans, after the president has made the decision, we should all get on the boat and show our support for the country!!
Just hope that it will be fast and precise, capture Saddam and his sons before there is any casualty..!
Bush doesn't hear his own wife, how's he going to hear tATu?
Anyway, this sucks. Let's hope the war keeps between Irak and US and doesn't drag any of the rest of us in it (no offense meant to the American members of the forum). And as for war, it started an hour and a half ago, so Yulia and Lena are probably asleep, non-aware of the war.
to start the war was a bad idea... I don't support it!
they should be, the deadline was given 48 hours ago
spyretto
20-03-2003, 04:50
..and I expect him to keep his promise. The world does not need "leaders" like Saddam Hussein.
i live in the U.S .... it seems like we dont have a choice.. this guy bush has decided that we are going to war.. no matter wut we say . we knew it was going to happen later or sooner.. i hope we get through this as fast as posible.
OK, before I start some of my views may be extreme to some people, and no offense is meant to anyone, nor do I wish harm on anyone...
I think no one is looking at the large picture. I mean, the REALLY large picture.. Like our planet's crisis.
Already over-populated, our world is headed towards certain doom. All natural resources will be soaked up at lightning speed. There will be an estimated more than 20 billion people on the planet in 75 years.
So, is the lost of lives good? Of course not, but it will do a little something. Now, on a few thousand lives aren't going to affect much, but large scale world war might..
Now for sure Nukes are a terrible thing. Scientists predict a nuclear winter as a result of one, and if a couple nukes are blown up the whole world is doomed. It will freeze over and humans will be eradicated from Earth.
So what I'm getting at is I have no opinion on the war. I do not care about innocents or guilty dying, from either side. Most people, deep deep down, probably feel the same. It is our animal instinct to only care about our own strain, making sure that at least our family lives and reproduces. Maybe a guilty pleasure to other's misfortune.. Now I am not a sadist and I'm certainly not saying any of you are..
In nature, there is a natural balance of population. The population rises, gets higher, then falls down far and slowly rebuilds. Humans have just kept rising. Soon enough there is bound to be fights for space, food, resources, etc.. Each person will scratch and bite just to survive. Peace will not be possible, with the mass chaos of it all. Think about people fleeing from a burning building. 9 out of 10 people would trample, kick, push down others so they could get out.
So, like I said before, I have no opinion on the war.
Well, I thank you for hearing me out. Love me or hate me, this is what I think...
Originally posted by felisk8
i live in the U.S .... it seems like we dont have a choice..
Yea they tried protesting but Bush wasn't tryin to hear that. I jus graduated H.S. last year and where I live at we don't takl about what colleges are we goin to or who got accepted where cuz either we can't afford it or schools don't want us. We just ask each other, "Army, Navy, or Marines?" I got a couple of friends that are probably out there right now not knowing what to expect. I pray for them and all the inoccent people that are gonna suffer and hopefully it will be over soon.
Also you gotta give it to Tatu, who else will come to a foreign country and wear shirts that say "F**k War!". Two beautiful, talented 18 year old girls that took the world by storm, thats who!
O-R-!-G-I-N
20-03-2003, 14:46
yup yup in the UK there were countless prtotest and our so-called Prime-Minister thought nothing of it, if only you could of seen the News...*pft*.
well i really think that every citizen of this planet has the right to express his opinion and feelings about something so important whatever your name is Bush or Tatu or alison or leila or whatever...it's everybody's problem whatever your opinion is...oh and i'm totally against it by the way...but it would be too long to explain so...PEACE everybody!
goku, - where did you get all this?
There's plenty of supply for everyone in the world, we are NOT overpopulated, and killing people is CERTAINLY not a solution.
Some scientists actully predict slow down in population growth, and even eventual drop.
I'm a US citizen, and I don't support this war. I have yet to hear an explaination of why we have done this that I believe. Terrorism? That was Afganistan. Weapons of mass destruction? Lots of countries have those, including the US (cluster bombs, air bombs, etc.). Are we going to go after them next? Maybe North Korea has a reason to be upset now. Historically, the US has supported much worse regimes than Iraq as political allies.
After the first Gulf War, can anyone doubt that if Iraq used those weapons of mass destruction in new attacks that they would be bombed back to the bronze age, if not the stone age? Plus the UN and international support would be there in full.
I don't have a problem with the US military. I expect them to do their jobs well. Its the politicians that I hold responsible. Like it or not, this is a diplomatic failure.
EeZeReal
20-03-2003, 21:37
Although saying that, Saddam is the biggest tyrant to hold such a powerful position over a country and his day was bound to come sometime soon. Why not make it now before he gets the chance to Kill/Exile more of his own people or actually use those weapons he's been brewing for so damn long.
YLuelniaa
20-03-2003, 23:58
Originally posted by Charles
I'm a US citizen, and I don't support this war. I have yet to hear an explaination of why we have done this that I believe. Terrorism?
I don't have a problem with the US military. I expect them to do their jobs well. Its the politicians that I hold responsible. Like it or not, this is a diplomatic failure.
Couldn't have said it better..you took the words out of my mouth
Hm, this war had to be done, I hope in two weeks the coalition forces will enter in Bagdad and all is over ... oh, and the oil price will go down !!
Only in recent history has humankind discovered the means with which to increase the average human lifespan and reduce infant mortality rate: sanitation practices and modern medicines. With these discoveries, we have multiplied our numbers faster than ever before, going from 1 billion to 2 billion in only 123 years, such a brief moment in human history. As is the nature of unchecked growth, the momentum accelerated and the world went from 5 billion people to 6 billion in only 12 short years. The balance of nature has been drastically upset and the environment is already paying the price.
"It's not because people started breeding like rabbits.
It's that they stopped dying like flies."
... Nicholas Eberstadt, a demographer at the American Enterprise Institute
The world is growing by more than 76 million people a year. At the current rate of growth, even accounting for a continual decrease in the growth rate, the world population is headed for double digits within 50 years. Every 20 minutes, the world adds another 3,500 human lives but loses one or more entire species of animal or plant life - at least 27,000 species per year. The world population has doubled in the last 40 years. It took just 12 years to leap from 5 billion to 6 billion. It took about 18 centuries for the earth to reach its first one billion inhabitants. The world is adding a city the size of Los Angeles every two weeks.
Birth rates are falling worldwide but death rates are declining even faster. A tiny fraction - only 7 percent - of the world's people live in countries where population is not growing.
If fertility remained at current levels, the population would reach the absurd figure of 296 billion in just 150 years. Even if it dropped to 2.5 children per woman and then stopped falling, the population would still reach 28 billion.
1.2 billion people worldwide are living on $1.00 a day or less.
Reasons Why Population Matters
Worsening water scarcity stems in large part from increases in human demand. Water tables are dropping world wide.
Pollution in cities is the number one killer of young children because of respiratory diseases. Cities are growing at an alarming rate.
Worldwide, 800 million people are malnourished, and the number could grow significantly. Farming lands are suffering from soil erosion and desertification.
The poor are getting poorer due to competition for resources while governments are strained to keep up with them and economies fail.
The world's oceans are overfished and the coral reefs are dying
Humanity is rapidly changing the earth's atmosphere and thus its climate
Wild habitats that shelter endangered plants and animals are giving way to human activities and needs
Disease knows no borders, and crowding helps spread disease, and lack of education in reproductive health is a factor in the recent upsurge of infectious disease
Migration pressures are aggravated by rapid population growth
Civil conflict often emerges in societies where rapid population growth combines with environmental scarcity to undermine governments.
At 1% Population Growth Rate, Only 1300 Years Before We Exceed One Person per Square Foot of Land.
http://www.overpopulation.org/
My thoughts are not far-fetched...
PowerPuff Grrl
21-03-2003, 02:49
Well, Bush said that he wants to restructure the Middle East with a Marshall-like Plan. Attacking Iraq and removing Saddam would be the gateway to that mission.
All I have to say is... alright. (Though they should've started with Saudi Arabia, IMHO.)
If Bush honestly wants to create stable democratic countries in the Middle East, then I say grrrreat!
However, history has proven that when it comes to selecting and installing leaders, America sucks ass. The US claims to have developed free-enterprise democracies but most of this development has come at the expense of the people's blood.
Like what Charles said "Historically, the US has supported much worse regimes than Iraq as political allies."
E.g.: Chile and Pinochet.
More recently Afghanistan; the Northern Alliance is just as bad as the Taliban. As soon as the Western Media's attention diverted from Afghanistan the women were treated in the same demeaning manner.
Even before then, the Taliban was supported by the US. The US tends to leave countries as soon as their purpose is served. And often, if not always, they leave them with dictators in charge.
But I kind of have faith. Britain is by their side and they tend to kick ass when installing leaders. I hope that this war is short as hell and something good actually comes out of it.
But I worry about the future of the UN. I never really liked the UN but it does serve some purpose.
Pinochet made Chile one of the most prosperous counties in South America, when it was on the way of becoming another Cuba or Vietnam.
Then he stept down.
goku, - that is al just one point of view. I heard completely different opinions. In any case- killing people is hardly an answer.
Agreed. That is what I said in my preface... :D
So, is the lost of lives good? Of course not, but it will do a little something.
Well, it is hardly the same as what I said.
This isn't really a war. It's a massacre. (Well, that is if all the Iraqi soldiers don't surrender.)
One American death due to actual warmongering.
Four American and twelve English deaths because of weather conditions.
*Shrugs.* This will be over in less than a month. My father and I are guessing about two to three weeks. Maybe even less.
I have no stance on the war.
~Echo.
And after the war? What will follow? The people there have nothing. I' ve heard that Bush had asked the UN, who wants to pay the reconstruction? Not the US! We have to pay, especially Germany! Because we always have to pay for such things! The US destroy everything ... and we have to pay! Super!
Fact is Bush doesn't want to help the people in the Iraq!
It's not his first priority to take a mad man's weapon away to rescue the people from an dictatorship. He wants the oil! He wants the control! Most people here in Germany have this opinion!
Bush is not much better than Hussein! He has also a lot of weapons, he doesn't care about the opinions of other states, and does what he wants!
And Mr. Blair is so stupid! 96 % of the people in his country are against the war.
The war won't hurt Hussein so much, just civilians will become hurt! And the future! A lot of people will escape from the Iraq, but they won't go to the US, no they will come to Europe, and to Germany...and if we would say no they would say...oh the nazis ( is that word right...I don't know!). I'm not a rassist, and we have a lot of people from differnt countries here, but Germany have no money for all these people...and not enough jobs. So what should we do? Of course war is not the answer! The US didn't have so many wars in the past like we in europe. Sometimes it seems so the they don't know what war means for the people there.
And I believe, if the US win the war, the Iraq wouldn't accept the new head of state...you see just more trouble in the future!
I don't want to be the bad girl! I'm just 17 years old and I hate war and the political way of Bush.
(Sorry, I know my english is not he best. I hope you can understand it right.)
PowerPuff Grrl
22-03-2003, 22:41
Tasiya, I agree with your concerns about the restructuring of Iraq. Funny, I always thought that US sharing that responsibility just showed that they still believe that international support is important.
However, when looking at it in a different perspective the UN always have done the groundwork for rebuilding shattered countries; the UN meaning everybody but the US. But with this situation the US cannot simply leave Iraq without the UN to look after it. After this war, Iraq can certainly become a hotspot for terrorist activities and the US cannot afford to have that happen.
France won't even discuss the possibility of funding Iraq after the war, rightfully so. The US has managed to piss everybody off (even the most laid back country in the world, Canada) with their statements of not needing the UN (an organization they built) and now they have the audacity to ask for funding. This only illustrates that US is only diplomatic when it suits their needs - you may roll your eyes at how clichйd that statement is - it surprisingly happens less often then you would believe.
I personally think the US and UK is in the right when attacking Iraq, not because I think they actually care for the well being for the Iraqi people. Fact is nobody cares, France won't attack Iraq, why would they? They built nuclear facilities for Saddam Hussien. Portions of Iraqi oil goes to France and Russia. I believe they are just as atrocious as the US and UK. France and Russia accept Iraqi goods despite funding a dictator.
So toppling a dictator and restructuring an oppressed country is good in my eyes no matter how evil the intentions are.
The problem isn't with Iraq anymore, it isn't even with how to restructure Iraq afterwards either. The problem now lies with filling in the gap the US and the UK has created with countries within the UN. The US cannot afford to go back into isolation, not after the globalized platform they have established now. Not after opening up so many trade benefits to so many places in the world. The anti-America attitude that is being acquired today does not come without justification. The US needs to change the bully image they have now with neglecting the UN and destroying diplomacy to the image they used to have when they estbalished the UN and created diplomacy.
I swear to God I'll try to keep them short next time.
Its all well and good to say the US must attack a dictatorship with an oppressive regime, but this doesn't hold up when you look at the whole world. If that is sufficient grounds to start a war, then how may more wars will we start? Is it any wonder that North Korea is upset?
The only reason Bush is getting away with this at all is that Iraq has zero allies that will come to their aid.
You're correct about the gap between the US/UK and the rest of the UN. That must be fixed before Iraq can be rebuilt. The US cannot perform any peacekeeping duties after the war. No one would trust them. That must fall to UN forces.
PowerPuff Grrl
22-03-2003, 23:47
Yeah, you're right about that.
I can name oher nations which need some intervention more than Iraq. But just because other countries need more help doesn't mean that sins of omission can be tolerated, even encouraged. Like what Bush said, Iraq is a gateway to reforming the Middle East. I think the reform doesn't end with Iraq.
I just hope he was being honest with this because it is really hard to trust their foreign policy.
Bush Sr. said that Kuwait would turn into a democratic nation after the Gulf War. I have heard recently that Kuwait is planning to become a theocracy.
On a side note, Africa really needs some attention. And not the kind of attention that has massive funding involved because the people that truly need it do not see a penny of it. I have no idea why governments keep funding actually expecting progress.
Has Tatu commented on the war recently?
deathrider
01-04-2003, 12:08
ok i think no one will be happy to see children killed and suffered in any place in this world
i think this war hasn't carry a peace and freedom to the iraq ppl
this war is only for kill ,brother kill his brother and for what , it's only for oil fuck oil
no more suffering for iraq ppl
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